Det er ikke nogen dårlig ide at interessere sig for hvad det er biblen virkeligt lærer.
Ikke mindst fordi vi her står over for et vaskeægte forsøg på bibelbedrag.
Jehovas vidner interesserer sig skam for den kristne bibel, og vi lader og kun vanskeligt narre. Derfor heller ikke i dette tilfælde.
Hvis det skulle interessere nogen, at se hvordan man undersøger et bedrag.
Jeg går slet ikke i dybden, men afslører manipulationen med simple midler.
Jeg bemærkede dette der blev skrevet i går, i et langt forvirret indlæg, uden hoved og hale.
Det er et af de forsøg der gøres fra en bibelcharlatan, en svindel og manipulation af biblen, der skrives for på et personligt grundlag at ramme Jehovas vidner. Det er oplagt det er formålet. At biblen så nærmest "omskrives" for at gøre det, er blasfemi.
2.PETERSBREV 1:1 - Codex Sinaiticus
ϲυμεων πετροϲ δουλοϲ και αποϲτολοϲ ιυ χυ τοιϲ ϊϲοτιμον ημιν
λαχουϲιν πιϲτιν ειϲ δικαιοϲυνην του κυ ημων και ϲωτηροϲ ιυ χυ
*******
Bibelselskabet ▬ Da92.
Fra Simon Peter, Jesu Kristi tjener og apostel. Til dem, der ved vor Guds og frelsers, Jesu Kristi, retfærdighed har fået den samme dyrebare tro som vi.
*******
....... versus ......
GB's NVO
Simon Peter, en Jesu Kristi træl og apostel, til dem der ligesom vi har opnået
troens privilegium ved vor Guds og [vor] Frelsers, Jesu Kristi, retfærdighed:
Læg så mærke til svindlen lader sig afsløre uden videre, og det efterlader debattøren som en afsløret altså en der benytter sig af fup og fiduser. Oven i købet en ateist der ikke tror på andet end sin egen svindel og bedrag.
Det er helt tydeligt man benytter udgangspunkt i den falske treenighedslære. Nok om det.
2. Petersbrev og Titus 2:13 kædes ofte sammen. For at gøre Jesus til Gud.
(Treenigheden igen igen)
Problemstillingen skyldes ganske enkelt grammatik, og da Peter skrev brevet, brugte han en udbredt talemåde, som ingen havde besvær med at forstå på den tid.
Vi behøver kun gå til 2.Peter 1:2, altså næste vers, hvilket den manipulerende debattør ikke gør opmærksom på. (næh det er klart [:X] )
Der står ud fra folkekirkens bibel:
Nåde og fred være med jer i stadig rigere mål i erkendelsen af Gud og Jesus, vor Herre!
Vi kan også prøve at se hvad der står i en anerkendt bibel som King james.
¨
Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and
our Saviour Jesus Christ:
og vers 2:
Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus
our Lord.
Der er absolut ingen tvivl om Peter ikke anså Jesus for at være Gud selv.
Dermed falder anklagen mod Jehovas vidner til jorden med et brag, da det ikke er en speciel måde at skrive biblen på, vi er alene om.
King James biblen blev udgivet i 1611. Tænk lidt over det von Münchausen.
Her er en redegørelse fra hvad andre mener.
Is Jesus God in 2 Peter 1.1?
by Servetus the Evangelical
The New Testament (NT) has two epistles whose authorship is accredited to the
Apostle Peter. Titles of books and letters of the Bible were often penned after they were
written and probably by a different hand. The early church unanimously accepted that
Peter wrote 1 Peter; but for centuries the church disputed whether he wrote 2 Peter. Most
modern, historical-critical, NT scholars have rejected that he did so. Since its salutation
attests to Peter’s authorship, and for other reasons, I am inclined to accept that he did.
The only problem passage in 1 and 2 Peter that has to do with whether Jesus is God
is 2 Peter 1.1. It has grammatical problems very similar to those in Titus 2.13 and 2
Thessalonians 1.12, which mostly concern word order. The question is, Does the last
phrase in 2 Peter 1.1 mention Two Persons, viz., the Father and Christ, or One Person,
viz., Christ? The One Person view calls Christ “God;” the Two Persons view does not.
The problematic phrase in 2 Peter 1.1 reads in the Greek text as follows, with an
interlinear translation supplied below it:
tou theou hemon kai soteros Iesou Christou
the God of us and Savior Jesus Christ
Only a few English Bible versions translate this phrase in 2 Peter 1.1 with two
Persons in view, in which case it does not call Jesus Christ “God.” In contrast, almost all
English versions translate it with one Person in view, so that it does call Jesus Christ
“God.” Bible versions (abbreviated in parenthesis) render this clause as follows:
Two Persons View:
“of God and our Savior Jesus Christ” (AV)
“of our God and the Savior Jesus Christ” (ASV, RSVmg, NRSVmg, NWT)
One Person View:
“of our God and Savior(,) Jesus Christ” (RV, NAB, TCNT, RSV, NEB, JB, NASB, NIV, NJB,
REB, NRSV, ESV)
Reasons which support that 2 Peter 1.1 calls Jesus Christ “God” are as follows, with
rebuttals appended:
1. In the Greek text, the absence of an article preceding soteros (Savior) indicates that
the pronoun hemon (our) applies only to theou (God).
Rebuttal: J.N.D. Kelly says “‘Savior’ tended to be anarthrous [no article],… and in
any case the correct use of the article was breaking down in late Greek.”
2. The doxology to Christ in 2 Peter 3.18 indicates the author could call Christ “God.”
Rebuttal: Doxologies addressed to Christ are irrelevant as to whether he is called
“God” because Jesus said of the Father, “it is his will that all should pay the same
honour to the Son as to the Father” (John 5.23 New English Bible).
3. Since it was common in Hellenistic lands to call religious and political figures “our
God,” it would have been natural for this author to call Christ “our God and Savior.”
Rebuttal: Divine inspiration prohibits pagan influence.
4. The nearby compound construction with its anarthrous soteros (Savior), in 2 Peter
1.11 (“our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ”), parallels “God” and “Savior” in v. 1,
which suggests that both are compound titles.
Rebuttal: The compound title, “Lord and Savior,” appears nowhere else in the NT
except in 2 Peter, and it occurs four times (2 Peter 1.11; 2.20; 3.2, 18). This evidence
along with the generally accepted late date of authorship for 2 Peter suggests that the
words, “Lord and Savior,” had by then become a fixed formula, making an article
preceding “Savior” assumed. This repeated compound title, “Lord and Savior,” in 2
Peter is not a suitable parallel for “God” and “Savior” in 2 Peter 1.1.
The following reasons support that 2 Peter 1.1 does not call Jesus Christ “God:”
1. The author would not call Jesus “God” in v.1 and inject confusion by distinguishing
God and Jesus later in the same sentence, in v. 2—“the knowledge of God, and of
Jesus our Lord.” So, the ambiguity in v. 1 should be interpreted by the clarity in v. 2.
Rebuttal: If the author had wanted to distinguish the Father and Jesus in v. 1 he would
have clearly done so, as in v. 2.
2. The expression, “our/the Lord and Savior (Jesus Christ),” had become a fixed formula
so that the use of “God” in v. 1 must be intended to distinguish God and Jesus.
Rebuttal: Authors should be considered free to vary a stereotyped expression.
3. The position of the pronoun hemon (our) between the two nouns—theou (God) and
soteros (Savior)—separates and thus distinguishes them.
Rebuttal: When two nouns have one article, one personal pronoun applies to both.
4. If Peter authored 1 and 2 Peter he would not have written, “the God and Father of our
Lord Jesus Christ” (1 Peter 1.3), and then call Jesus “God” in 2 Peter. Plus, Peter
never calls Jesus “God” in any of his evangelistic speeches recorded in Acts
Murray Harris has thoroughly surveyed the scholarly landscape regarding this
dispute in 2 Peter 1.1. He says the One Person view of it is “endorsed by the great
majority of twentieth-century commentators with varying degrees of assurance.” But it
should be noted that only a few prominent NT exegetes wrote commentaries on 2 Peter in
the 20th century, partly because most of them thought Peter did not write it, and some did
not think it should have been included in the NT. Preeminent lexicographer Walter Bauer
is typical of those scholars who are non-commital. He insists concerning both 2 Peter 1.1
and 1 John 5.20 that “the interpretation is open to question.
Ps. Hvorfor skal nogen debattører altid lyve, platte og svindle, stort set hver eneste gang de skriver noget.
Og de er ikke til at drive til at tage ansvar for deres utallige løgne og løgnagtige indlæg.